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Iain McGilchrist – Wisdom Over Power: Why Contemplation & Wonder Are Essential for the Future of Humanity

February 28, 2025

(Conversation recorded on January 2nd, 2025)

Show Summary

When looking at our global challenges, it can be easier to focus on the external factors that could be different. Yet a critical part of creating impactful change is turning the scope of reflection inward towards how our patterns of thinking influence the way we contribute to our surroundings. Is it possible that a path toward a better future begins in our own heads?

Today Nate is joined by psychiatrist and neurologist Iain McGilchrist for a deep dive on the implications of western society’s over-reliance on analysis and categorization on the quality and expectations of our leadership and governance systems. Iain emphasizes the need for a shift in perspective, advocating for wisdom over power and a deeper understanding of the impact of technology on our values and attention.

How can spiritually healthy and aware individuals lead the way towards societal change rooted in wisdom? How can focusing on the well-being of our closest communities create ripple-effects of emergence for broader humanity? Finally, how can embracing wonder and humility throughout our lives – in the face of our scariest challenges – guide us towards a more interconnected and sentient humanity?

About Iain McGilchrist

Dr. Iain McGilchrist is a Quondam Fellow of All Souls College, Oxford, an Associate Fellow of Green Templeton College, Oxford, a Fellow of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, a Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts, and former Consultant Psychiatrist and Clinical Director at the Bethlem Royal & Maudsley Hospital, London.

Iain has been a Research Fellow in neuroimaging at Johns Hopkins Hospital, Baltimore and a Fellow of the Institute of Advanced Studies in Stellenbosch. He has published original articles and research papers in a wide range of publications on topics in literature, philosophy, medicine and psychiatry.

Iain is the author of a number of books, but is best-known for The Master and his Emissary: The Divided Brain and the Making of the Western World (2009); and his book on neuroscience, epistemology, and ontology called The Matter with Things: Our Brains, Our Delusions and the Unmaking of the World (2021).

Show Notes & Links to Learn More

PDF Transcript

00:00 – Iain McGilchrist info + works, prior TGS Episode, The Master and His Emissary, The Matter with Things 

01:40 – The divided brain animated video

11:55 – Complex systems 

12:47 – Duck-Rabbit illusion

13:52 – Matthew 22:36-40

19:59 – Louis Lavelle

21:28 – Max Scheler + hierarchy of values 

22:18 – Martin Heidegger

22:46 – Gotthold Ephraim Lessing

31:57 – Roman Empire + Ancient Greece

33:23 – Multilevel selection

33:25 – E.O. Wilson, David Sloan Wilson + TGS Episode

43:24 – Abraham Heschel + on wonder

47:58 – Margaret Mead

52:03 – Rod Dreher + Substack blog + The Benedict Option

52:24 – Oxford Literary Festival

58:00 – Michel de Montaigne

1:01:30 – Aletheia

1:05:00 – Alfred North Whitehead

1:05:16 – Stephen Jay Gould + on science and God

1:06:38 – Alex O’Connor podcast + conversation with Iain McGilchrist

1:10:45 – Postmodernism

1:22:59 – The structure of the periodic table + the ring structure of benzene came from dreams

1:23:42 – Sigmund Freud

1:24:51 – Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

1:27:22 – Viktor Frankl

1:32:24 – Dunbar’s number

1:36:13 – Solzhenitsyn’s nobel speech

1:37:10 – The Sovereign Individual Frankly

1:41:09 – Indra’s net

1:42:20 – Verb-based languages

1:44:12 – Tonal languages

1:50:18 – Jude Currivan

1:58:13 – Patrick Ophuls

Nate Hagens

Nate Hagens

Nate Hagens is the Executive Director of The Institute for the Study of Energy & Our Future (ISEOF). Allied with leading ecologists, energy experts, politicians, and systems thinkers, ISEOF assembles roadmaps for understanding how human societies might adapt to lower-throughput lifestyles.

Nate hosts the podcast The Great Simplification, where he has conversations with experts in energy, ecology, government, technology, and the economy to provide a systemic view of the world around us.

After ten years in finance, Nate left Wall Street to study the interrelationships between energy, ecology, and economics—and the implications for human futures. He was the Managing Editor of The Oil Drum, one of the most respected websites for analysis and discussion of global energy supplies and implications of the upcoming energy transition.

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